I've had Japanese students who've used Kuriki et al's work on Japanese color terms in their research and generally agreed with the paper's "definitions" of the focal colors; here's a link to that: jov.arvojournals.org/article.aspx...

And I bring it up because the "ao"/"mizu" distinction it has in Figure 1 is seemingly mostly lightness (scroll down a bit, it's the bar graph). So, actually, I guess my intuition was wrong in the preceding message. Whoops! 🫥